Resources For SDAs Only Solid Proof that Ellen White Never Became Trinitarian
| Solid Proof that Ellen White Never Became Trinitarian |
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There are many professed Seventh-day Adventists who, in support of the trinity doctrine, say that Ellen White changed the anti-trinitarian thinking of the church by writing a book called "The Desire of Ages" in 1898.They say that when people began to read this book they came to understand that God is really a trinity. They say it was Ellen White who changed the thinking of the church. Now, let us notice something most significant. Most of us are reasonably familiar with Scripture and the writings of Ellen White; so I want to ask this: Do you agree that Ellen G. White would've been classed as a false prophet if she held "heretical views" on the Godhead? Do you agree that Ellen G. White would've been classed as a false prophet if she consistently contradicted herself? Do you believe that God gives revelation to people or groups who subscribe to "heretical doctrines", like denying the Trinity? Friends, I believe with all my heart and soul, that Ellen G. White was/is a True Prophet of God - The God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah, Moses, David, Elijah, Daniel, John the Baptist, Paul, and John the Revelator. Furthermore, my objective is not necessarily to disprove the trinity doctrine. My prime purpose is to interpret Ellen White's statements [on whatever subject] so that nothing contradicts (RH, November 25, 1884 par. 24). In an effort to do that very thing, it will be proven that Ellen White was NOT a trinitarian. It will be proven that those who advocate her as being "trinitarian", thus make her into a false prophet. And more importantly, it will be proven how the trinity doctrine destroys the Atonement and the Sanctuary Service messages. I cannot overstate how vital it is that we understand this. Now please, let us review the Desire of Ages paragraph immediately above, this time, paying extra attention to the portions that are underlined, as well as the portion that is capitalized: DA 671: "The power of evil had been strengthening for centuries, and the submission of men to this Satanic captivity was amazing. Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fullness of divine power. It is the Spirit that makes effectual what has been wrought out by the world's Redeemer. It is by the Spirit that the heart is made pure. Through the Spirit the believer becomes a partaker of the divine nature. CHRIST HAS GIVEN HIS SPIRIT AS A DIVINE POWER TO OVERCOME ALL HEREDITARY AND CULTIVATED TENDENCIES TO EVIL, AND TO IMPRESS HIS OWN CHARACTER UPON HIS CHURCH." Most SDAs do not recognize the subject of the Godhead as a Landmark or Pillar doctrine of pioneer Seventh-day Adventism: "Those who seek to remove the old landmarks are not holding fast; they are not remembering how they have received and heard. Those who try to bring in theories that would remove the pillars of our faith concerning the sanctuary or concerning the personality of God or of Christ, are working as blind men. They are seeking to bring in uncertainties and to set the people of God adrift without an anchor." (E.G. White, Manuscript Releases 760 9.5) "I entreat every one to be clear and firm regarding the certain truths that we have heard and received and advocated. The statements of God's Word are plain. Plant your feet firmly on the platform of eternal truth. Reject every phase of error, even though it be covered with a semblance of reality, which denies the personality of God and of Christ." (Review and Herald, August 31, 1905 par. 11) "The Father and the Son each have a personality. Christ declared: "I and My Father are one." Yet it was the Son of God who came to the world in human form. Laying aside His royal robe and kingly crown, He clothed His divinity with humanity, that humanity through His infinite sacrifice might become partakers of the divine nature and escape the corruption that is in the world through lust." (9T pages 67-68) Is it not interesting that Ellen White does NOT mention the personality of the Holy Spirit in the above statements? IF the Holy Spirit has been the third person of the Godhead since eternity past, then why does she not mention Him? The reason she does not is because she elsewhere defines the personality of the Holy Spirit to be that of the life and soul of Christ, and it would thus be redundant to mention the personality of the Holy Spirit as extra to that of God and Christ. What Was the Landmark SDA Teaching Concerning the Identity of the Holy Spirit? "The Power of God in the Third Person.--The prince of the power of evil can only be held in check by the power of God in the third person of the Godhead, the Holy Spirit." (E.G. White, Special Testimonies, Series A, No. 10, p. 37) {1897}. DA 671: "Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead ...". The Bible says that it is Jesus, God's Son, whom the Father sent to bless us, turning away every one of us from our iniquities. Acts 3:26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities. The "power of evil" is synonymous with iniquity, so unless Ellen White disagreed with the Bible, (and she did not!), we know that the Son is the Holy Spirit - which is the ONLY agency which holds in check or resists the prince of the power of evil or iniquity. Did Ellen White Say that the Holy Spirit was Christ? "Christ declared that after his ascension, he would send to his church, as his crowning gift, the Comforter, who was to take his place. This Comforter is the Holy Spirit,--the soul of his life, the efficacy of his church, the light and life of the world. With his Spirit Christ sends a reconciling influence and a power that takes away sin. In the gift of the Spirit (HIS LIFE--THE SOUL OF HIS LIFE), Jesus gave to man the highest good that heaven could bestow. ... The Spirit was given as a regenerating agency, and without this the sacrifice of Christ would have been of no avail. ... It is by the Spirit that the heart is made pure. Through the Spirit the believer becomes a partaker of the divine nature. Christ has given his Spirit as a divine power to overcome all hereditary and cultivated tendencies to evil, and to impress his own character upon the church." (E.G. White, Review and Herald , May 19, 1904 par. 1, 2, 3). Thus we have the landmark pillar doctrine teaching of the pioneers concerning the Godhead. It becomes clear that any other doctrine would work total despite to the Atonement and the Sanctuary doctrine as well as the terms of the Everlasting Covenant, which demanded the death of the Testator. What the Trinity Doctrine blasphemes is the fact that Jesus shed His Holy Spirit FOREVER, to become invested with humanity. This is one of the greatest condescension's of the Incarnation, and the Trinity Doctrine denies this great sacrifice on the part of our Lord, Jesus Christ. The trinity doctrine teaches that this other spirit which is separate from Christ's breath of His own Spirit, His own life, abides in men, rather than the life of CHRIST'S OWN LIFE abiding in men. This is an abomination. This is blasphemy. This is antichrist. James White, J.N. Andrews, and ALL the other SDA pioneers recognized this truth. The regeneration--regenerating agency was NOT Christ's death on the cross. It was something else without which "His sacrifice on the cross would have been of no avail". That "something else", was His Holy Spirit mind, soul and breath, in addition to His blood shed on the cross. The other three--the Holy Spirit mind, soul and breath, was shed or laid aside at His Incarnation, to be [later] given to us, as a gift, for the purpose of regeneration-regenerating us into the image of God. THAT was the highest good and the crowing gift that Christ gave to us, NOT only the death of His humanity on the Cross. For without the regenerating Holy Spirit life, breath and soul (mind) of Christ, sin could have proliferated forever. That is another reason why the truth of this issue is so relevant to the Sacrifice of Christ and EVERYTHING He sacrificed - not just the cross. The Cross Sacrifice provided for justification. The Incarnation Sacrifice provided for sanctification. "Christ gives them the breath of HIS OWN SPIRIT, the life of HIS OWN LIFE. The HOLY SPIRIT puts forth its highest energies to work in the heart and mind." (E.G. White, Desire of Ages, p. 827). All this could mean is: exactly what Ellen White says that it means. The Holy Spirit is the life, breath and soul of Christ - imparted to us as a regenerating agency, made possible for the first time under the New Covenant, by Christ "laying aside that life" and "bequeathing it to us". If Christ had not given His original life Holy Spirit as a regenerating agency, then His sacrifice on the Cross would have been of no avail, because man could never have overcome and the Sanctuary would never have been cleansed. The Cross provided justification for sins past, but the Holy Spirit life, breath and soul of Christ, which He possessed in Heaven before His Incarnation into humanity, was ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY for sanctification, overcoming, and the final cleansing of the Sanctuary. Without this gift the Sanctuary would never be cleansed. This is what Ellen White was referring to, when in the Alpha of Apostasy, she saw THE SANCTUARY GONE--THE ATONEMENT GONE. In other words, IF Christ did not give us His original state-of-being Holy Spirit as a regenerating agency, the Atonement could have never been complete and would have been of no avail. "In a representation which passed before me, I saw a certain work being done by medical missionary workers. Our ministering brethren were looking on, watching what was being done, but they did not seem to understand. The foundation of our faith, which was established by so much prayer, such earnest searching of the Scriptures, was being taken down, pillar by pillar. Our faith was to have nothing to rest upon--the sanctuary was gone, the atonement was gone." (E.G. White, The Upward Look, p.152). This is what the Omega Heresy of the trinity doctrine has achieved. It completely denies that Christ sacrificed His personal Holy Spirit at His Incarnation. Acceptance of the trinity doctrine makes the Atonement and the Sanctuary Service null and void, because it is by CHRIST'S PERSONAL Holy SPIRIT that sanctification is effected. The trinity doctrine teaches that Christ did not sacrifice His personal Holy Spirit. The trinity doctrine teaches that the Holy Spirit was another separate and distinct person from - the person of the Son. Without the sacrifice of the Son's own personal Holy Spirit, AT HIS INCARNATION, to be given as a regenerating agency, the entire sacrifice of Christ would be null and void and the requirement of the FOREVER death of the Testator of the Covenant - would not be met. The Scriptural answer to this conundrum is that the Holy Spirit was and is the life, breath and soul of the Son, until the Son gave up His first state-of-being (pure Divinity) to be forever linked with humanity at His Incarnation. This is the ONLY answer that makes all Ellen White statements on the subject of the Godhead, interpret so that nothing contradicts. James Franks.
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  written by Natalie K, February 23, 2009
We should be careful not to lose sight of the fact that the word trinity was invented by the Catholics, and that their understanding of the trinity is not Biblical. As long as we keep in mind that God the Father and God the Son share the same spirit, all is well. "The nature of the Holy Spirit is a mystery. Men cannot explain it, because the Lord has not revealed it to them. Men having fanciful views may bring together passages of Scripture and put a human construction on them, but the acceptance of these views will not strengthen the church. Regarding such mysteries, which are too deep for human understanding, silence is golden." Acts of the Apostles, pg. 51.
 written by Real Michaud, February 22, 2009
no where in her writtings does she say the Holy Spirit is an actual entity. If you read the versus I put up it says in plain language that the Comforter who is the Holy Spirit is Jesus Christ. Christ said it himself.
Mrs White never meant for anyone to believe that the "third person" of the Godhead was an actual person except the personality, power and presence of Jesus Christ. It is a gramatical statement not a literal belief that the Holy Spirit is an actual person. In Revelation Jesus is at the right had on God the Father next to his eternal throne, might I ask who is on the left side? How come this other person the Holy Ghost the "third person" of the Trinity is never spoken of? Where is he? Is he on earth with Satan during the thousand years trying to convert him? Is he floating around from galaxy to galaxy with nowhere to go. No the Holy Spirit is the personal precence of Jesus in our souls. Period I will bring more to the forefront as time goes on. Sola Scriptura my friends. All things Mrs. White has written must, I reiterate must be validated by the Bible and the Bible alone.
 written by Derick, February 22, 2009
Ellen White's proof that there IS a Godhead.
III. Three Persons in the Godhead There are three living persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers--the Father, the Son, and the (442) Holy Spirit--those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.-- Evangelism, p. 615. {7ABC 441.9} The Godhead was stirred with pity for the race, and the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit gave themselves to the working out of the plan of redemption.--Counsels on Health, p. 222. {7ABC 442.1} Those who proclaim the third angel's message must put on the whole armor of God, that they may stand boldly at their post, in the face of detraction and falsehood, fighting the good fight of faith, resisting the enemy with the word, "It is written." Keep yourselves where the three great powers of heaven, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, can be your efficiency. These powers work with the one who gives himself unreservedly to God. The strength of heaven is at the command of God's believing ones. The man who takes God as his trust is barricaded by an impregnable wall.--The Southern Watchman, Feb. 23, 1904, p. 122. {7ABC 442.2} Our sanctification is the work of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. It is the fulfilment of the covenant that God has made with those who bind themselves up with Him, to stand with Him, with His Son, and with His Spirit in holy fellowship. Have you been born again? Have you become a new being in Christ Jesus? Then co-operate with the three great powers of heaven who are working in your behalf. Doing this you will reveal to the world the principles of righteousness.--The Signs of the Times, June 19, 1901. {7ABC 442.3} The eternal heavenly dignitaries--God, and Christ, and the Holy Spirit--arming them [the disciples] with more than mortal energy, . . . would advance with them to the work and convince the world of sin.--Evangelism, p. 616. {7ABC 442.4} We are to co-operate with the three highest powers in heaven, --the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost,--and these powers will work through us, making us workers together with God.-- Ibid., p. 617. {7ABC 442.5} Those who are baptized in the threefold name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, at the very entrance of their Christian life declare publicly that they have forsaken the service of Satan and have become members of the royal family, children of the heavenly king.--Testimonies, vol. 6, p. 91. {7ABC 442.6}
written by Real Michaud, February 20, 2009
Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I say unto you I speak not from myself: but the Father abiding in me doeth his works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father. Joh 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, that will I do. Joh 14:15 If ye love me, ye will keep my commandments. Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever, Joh 14:17 even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you. Joh 14:18 I will not leave you desolate: I come unto you. Jesus promised us another Comforter in verse 16. In verse 18 our Lord says, " I will not leave your desolate: I come unto you.(Using the American Standard verson)The revised KJV says I will not leave you comfortless, I will come to you. Now everything above is Jesus himself. Who does it say the Comforter is? It says that Jesus is the comforter and he will not leave us desolate. There is no way by reading this that the Holy Spirit which is the Comforter is some third person of the Godhead and/or Trinity. There is no other but the Holy Almighty Father in Heaven and His son the Savior of the World our Lord and brother the man Christ Jesus.
written by Natalie K, February 06, 2009
Thank you, Hadassah, for sharing that. I think that is significant and you should spread the word about it. Thank you again for sharing.
In His love and service, WLC Team
 written by Hadassah Sinclair, February 02, 2009
My husband has been a pastor etc with the SDA for over 60 years. We have an old Adventist Hymnal that includes the song Holy Holy Holy and the last part of the song goes, Holy Holy Holy, God in Eternity, blessed unity, there is no mention of God in three persons, blessed trinity.
 written by Stephen Le Mense, December 09, 2008
Alright, I'll try not to.
It's just hurtful for me to see that SDA's dont know that even the leaders of the SDA churches greet with the Pope..and the SDA Church is just a finger dangling off a hand that is from Roman Catholicism just like how the Protestants are today. I mean, you can give me Scripture verses and all, but why dont you take that to heart and leave the SDA? You dont need SDA, same with all the other "branches" that I've mentioned. You know as well as I do that they need to free themselves from that, and sadly this is the same thing...You got the Bible, all you need to Christ dude. You dont need a Church to define you, nor do you need anyone other than Christ to define you. Im not trying to start anything, It's what I see...All these things are constantly surrounding us and we are to be fully aware of these "fellowships"..it's not going to cut for salvation, not even the single day of Sabbath Day (Saturday) will bring us to salvation..
written by Real Michaud, December 08, 2008
Please do not equate me or my belief system (which is biblically sound) with JW's, Mormons or anyone else. I will show you by Bible verse that everything I said was biblical. My reply will be very soon, so stay tuned!
written by Stephen Le Mense, December 08, 2008
Real Michaud stated: "Christ became man so we could become just like God. Christ is our brother and God is our Father. If Christ could use that power, so can we because we can become just like God. We can become the express image of Christ before God. Our brother Jesus said that his followers would do greater works than he did. Christ was our example. He had the Holy Spirit, now that he is heaven, he is with us through his Spirit."
My reply: You cant be serious... Looking at Christ as if he is our "BROTHER", an EXAMPLE, He's considered a nothing with God but just so happens He is God in the flesh and the son of God? Christ died on the cross for mankind, we didnt...our persecution is brought by following Christ and God Almighty ALONE...That doesnt work around. The things you said, are the same heretical views that got the Catholic Church believing what they are believing, the Jehovah's Witness, the Mormons, the Calvinists, etc.. God sent a revelation, sacrificing of a Lamb who'd redeem mankind...and that Lamb of God was Christ Jesus... Christ is more than a simple man, a mediator, one with power to heal and revive and bring salvation to man... HE IS ALMIGHTY GOD IN THE FLESH AS WELL AS THE HOLY SPIRIT.
written by Real Michaud, December 05, 2008
Christ never gave up the Spirit of God (the Holy Ghost) because it was given to him by his father in heaven. What Christ gave up was his omnipotence and his ability to present everywhere at the same time. Christ became man so we could become just like God. Christ is our brother and God is our Father.
If Christ did not have the Holy Spirit (love and power of God) then what spirit did he have? Christ did nothing without the Father, but he used the power of his Father to feed and heal and to prophesi.(sorry cant spell worth a hill of beans). If Christ could use that power, so can we because we can become just like God. We can become the express image of Christ before God. Our brother Jesus said that his followers would do greater works than he did. Christ was our example. He had the Holy Spirit, now that he is heaven, he is with us through his Spirit. Amazing but true. And thank God.
written by Real Michaud, December 05, 2008
I do not disagree with your answer in total, but it is a fair question to ask. The hymn Holy Holy Holy does have the words, "God in three persons, blessed trinity"
I think that is why the questioner asked the question. Once again to the quesetioner, Holy Holy Holy was in the adventist hymnal for quite some time, but the words were changed sometime in the mid twentieth century to the current, "God in three persons, blessed trinity". It was never originally in there. And to the Administrators of WLC, do not be so pretentous to say you have nothing to say about the SDA church. This article is in the category of For SDA's only. Lets be nice. It was an honest question and viable question, and one that needs to answered.
 written by afolabi samuel, December 05, 2008
First off, we want you to know that we are not part of the SDA denomination and so we cannot answer for them. We are a team of non-denominational volunteers dedicated to sharing the last message of mercy given in the Bible. We urge you to read the link “about us” in the following: http://worldslastchance.com/ab...ound.html
Now to answer your question in details, please know that to sing “holy holy holy” does not make the Holy Spirit a distinct and separate divine being apart from God Himself. The word “holy’ is an adjective which qualifies the spirit to help us know what type it is, whether of God or evil. The Holy Spirit of God is spoken of as God’s “presence,” (Psalm 51:11; 139:7) and this presence is said to be everywhere. In addition, the book of Revelation depicts the heavenly beings singing Holy, holy, holy to our loving heavenly Father in Revelation 4:8. "And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come." Therefore the Holy Spirit is NOT a separate person from that of the Father and His Son. (See Roman 8:9). Strictly speaking, the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father, which “proceedeth from the Father,” (John 15:26) yet at times, the Holy Spirit is called, “the Spirit of Christ.” For example, compare 1 Peter 1:11 and 2 Peter 1:21. Both of these are true, for Jesus received His Father’s Spirit without measure (John 3:34), so that the Son has His Father’s Spirit. The Bible says that God sends us His Spirit through His Son. “Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour.” (Titus 3:5, 6) By this process we gain the added benefit of receiving not only the Spirit of the Father, but also the Spirit of His Son. Jesus said, “If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” (John 14:23) Paul wrote, “because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.” (Galatians 4:6) Jesus said, “I am in the Father, and the Father in me.” (John 14:10) If we receive the Spirit of one (the Father or the Son), we automatically receive the Spirit of the other, for they dwell in each other the same way they dwell in us, by their Spirit. “Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.” (1 John 2:23) “Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.” (2 John 1:9) So in conclusion, When we receive the Spirit of the Son, we receive the Spirit of the Father also because the Father dwells in His Son by His Spirit. However, we should not worship, praise, or pray to their Spirit . I hope this helps to clarify your question. In His love and service, WLC Team.
 written by tsikada, December 05, 2008
The idea that Christ gave up the Holy Ghost in the heavenly sanctuary at His incarnation I find fascinating but I am yet to see sound biblical basis or EGW support for it. I find the quote in Desire of Ages places the giving of the Holy Spirit as a regenerative agent by Christ future of His dialogue with His disciples and not at His incarnation. Note the areas in the quote I highlighted, my comments are in brackets:- "In describing to His disciples the office work of the Holy Spirit, Jesus sought to inspire them with the joy and hope that inspired His own heart. He rejoiced because of the abundant help He had provided for His church. The Holy Spirit was the highest of all gifts that He could solicit from His Father for the exaltation of His people. (this refers to Christ's work in asking for the Holy Spirit on behalf of His disciples after His ascension---John 14:16" And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever
 The Spirit was to be given ( this means future) as a regenerating agent, and without this the sacrifice of Christ would have been of no avail. (In context, the English language allows this statement to mean that if Christ had not sent the Spirit after ascension, His sacrifice on the cross would have been of no avail in the experience of the saints....this understanding is actually strengthened by the rest of the qoute....)The power of evil had been strengthening for centuries, and the submission of men to this Satanic captivity was amazing. Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead, who would come (again emphasis is after ascension) with no modified energy, but in the fullness of divine power. It is the Spirit that makes effectual what has been wrought out by the world's Redeemer.(at the cross) It is by the Spirit that the heart is made pure. Through the Spirit the believer becomes a partaker of the divine nature. Christ has given His Spirit as a divine power to overcome all hereditary and cultivated tendencies to evil, and impress His own character upon His church." DA 672. It is however clear that the Holy spirit is the very life and breath of Christ. But I can find no where in Bible or S.O.P that says that Christ gave up His Spirit at the incarnation.
written by Real Michaud, December 05, 2008
if it is not true that the holy spirit is a person then why do SDAs are singing the Holy Holy Holy?
that is a fair question. I do not have a really concrete answer as to why, but I do know that it was added to the adventist hymnal in the current fashion in the middle of the twetieth century. I do know that it was in older hymnals, but the wording was different not to show a trinitarian bent. If someone from the administration can add to this comment and clarify or correct my answer that would be good. but a fair question
 written by Arvin Jude Rapano, December 05, 2008
if it is not true that the holy spirit is a person then why do SDAs are singing the Holy Holy Holy?
written by Stephen Le Mense, December 02, 2008
Im not Anti-Ellen White. What you replied with "She was only human and fallible. She is not above the Bible, and she never called herself a prophet, but only a "humble messanger of God".. If though by any chance, we start claiming Revelation and starting having followers that uses our references to define/outline a sect/religion/division/whatever you want to call it...That's a problem.
 I hope you know where Im going with this...Im trying to make it as small as possible. lol
written by realmichaud, December 01, 2008
I have been accused of that also without a shred of evidence. She has always quoted and referenced where her ideas came from. Also Mrs. White quotes the Bible more than any other source.
Also, why are you so anti Ellen White. She was only human and fallible. She is not above the Bible, and she never called herself a prophet, but only a "humble messanger of God". That is it.
written by Stephen Le Mense, December 01, 2008
I will give examples even with Charles Taze Russell, Joseph Smith. Stating, "You won't be told at the SDA Seminars about the things they have in common with the Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons.
SDA's share their early history with the Jehovah's Witnesses. An early Adventist, N. H. Barbour co-published with Charles Taze Russell. They had a falling out over (what else?) dates for the end of the world! (1844 and 1874), and parted company. Both, however, kept heretical doctrines to this day like Jesus being Michael the Archangel, the denial of Hell, and both still advocate soul sleep. Both invented invisible occurrences in heaven for their failed dates for Christ's visible return, investigative judgment for the SDA's and Christ's invisible "presence" for Jehovah's Witnesses. There is Mormon link also for the SDA's. It is a proven fact that Ellen G. White plagiarized most of her writings. The Church has been challenged by Walter Rea, author of the White Lie to prove that even 20% of her writings are original. They can't. Their weak defense was that there were no copyright laws in Ellen's day, so what she did was legal. You will never be told of her plagiarism by the SDA's. Walter Rae's Book, The White Lie exposes Ellen's snatching of a portrait that was from Great Controversy which had a signature of WR on the right side...yet she cut that out, and changed the size of the picture and placed it in here book. "As Ellen was rising to prominence, Joseph Smith had just died. Her writings contain many phrases used by Joseph Smith. Mind you, he has also been accused of plagiarism. I have a thick file of similarities, but time does not permit details at this time, but it does illustrate just how far her "borrowing" went. You will definitely not be told of her similarities to Joseph Smith at the Seminars!" "Ellen G. White subjects the Bible to the scrutiny of her "Testimonies" through the agent of her own self-proclaimed authority, supposedly given by God. By what reason should a person accept the self-proclaimed words of Ellen G. White over those of the Mormon, Joseph Smith, or the Jehovah's Witness, Charles Taze Russell, or the Christian Science, Mary Baker Eddy? All of them claimed to have received revelations from God, were self-proclaimed prophets, and all of them presented no credentials to verify their claims and all contradicted one another. Someone had to be wrong, and based on their track record of prophecies, it appears they were all wrong." Now I know Seventh Day Adventists are too (with those who know about the Vatican's involvement and try exposing it) considered a "nothing" to the Jesuits. Her "predictions" and documents should be nothing to look at "awe" about. She's not the same as those who wrote the Gospel.. Im not bashing, or lying, etc.. All Im saying is she was doing what many did in those times...That's why we have so many divisions within Christ's people...Look at Jehovah's Witness, and Mormons..Just as heretical as the next one who's making a division. Why follow Ellen if people of those days could've just opened the Bible and didnt hear anything of Christ's shouting, the 7 churches, Babylon the Great is Fallen, the Warning of the Angels, etc.. Again, why need a her to even explain anything and to be given enough attention to, to even make SDA take in her beliefs? It is anti Scripture, heretical, and false following. Ellen White shouldnt speak to people of the Gospel, Christ should. COMMENT REPLY: Oh I know what you meant realmichaud, I just used it to expand the subject as saying "Trinity is wrong, but THEN so is SDA" Heck, we may as well look at just how heretical Westboro Baptist Church is, the Catholics, the Calvinists, the Mormons, the Jehovah's Witness, Protestants arent even Protestants anymore...People are claiming to be prophets, yet they astray from Christ, and turn to a simple religion.. Christ warns us of Revelation, even to say John who wrote it from inspiration of God. And to make her (Ellen White) something bigger than a simple woman with a simple insight, and simply plagiarized insights from other heretics..that's just straight up dangerous. *Message is all in good intention.
written by realmichaud, November 30, 2008
to Mr. Le Mense,
I was not refering to the acceptance of Mrs. White or the rejection of her. I was speaking of the larger picture of the trinity doctrine. Either some people will accept the truth that the trinity is of Satanic origin, or they wont.
 written by galal Doss, November 30, 2008
Hello Stephen
You have made some very bold claims against Ellen White. Would you please share with us specifics backed up by direct quotes from her writings. We are open to receiving anything from your side. And I trust that you will likewise reciprocate and resolve to be as open too. In His love and service, WLC Team.
written by Stephen Le Mense, November 30, 2008
Although she have made good points, she still held on to heretical views. She was wrong on prophecies, she believed the end would come swiftly in her lifetime...I mean, sadly she's an example of how misleading even the Jehovah's Witnesses, Catholicism, Mormonism, others who express false Biblical Doctrines and interpretations was and still is. She even was pointed out as being a partaker in plagiarism. But even though Im not a Seventh Day Advent layman, I feel this has to be pointed out to help those who are, to be freed from even the divisions within Christian community.. Otherwise people are just giving excuses to just create any separation and therefore would try justifying their beliefs even in those outside of Biblical Doctrine. And like what comment ended with "Some will accept it, and some will reject it"...And to add on that is, "Do people REALLY know why to reject and to accept other interpretations?" I mean, if SDA's have to keep Ellen G. White's interpretations in order to understand more of Biblical Doctrine, then I have to ask myself "What is going on here!?"
That's just my comment though, no worries. 8/
written by realmichaud, November 26, 2008
Unfortunatly, that Serpent, the Dragon, Satan twists Mrs. White's writing. Although it is clear the Bible says that the Man Christ Jesus himself is the Holy Spirit, which ishis personal presence in the hearts and minds of mankind, Satan twists statements like, "the third person of the Godhead", and "the three great powers of the Godhead", to mean that the Holy Spirity is a seperate person from God the Father and the Man Christ Jesus.
There is only one God and one Lord who is his son the Man Christ Jesus, who was begotten and sacrificed to save man from sin. The mystery of iniquity is written into the doctrine of the Trinity. It is Satan who wants to become that "Holy Spirit" to become like the Most High. If the false doctrine of the Diety of Mary won't work, he will say that there is another person in the Godhead. A trinity. A mystery. God is no mystery. God has always been and always will be. Jesus Christ our Lord is the Creator of all things, because all things were given to him by God. Yes there are three great powers in Heaven. God Almighty, his son the Man Christ Jesus, the Holy Spirit which is the Love and Power of God and his Son living in the hearts of men and women. God is love and his spirit is love. This message will be given to all the SDA church. Some with accept it, and some will reject it. All that can shake is gonna shake! Thank God!
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